The following is an E-Panel of Publicists. They are frequently some of the busiest people in the business and seemingly know everything that is going on within the industry, both inside and outside the companies they work for.
Those participating in this E-Panel are:
Lauren Snyder – Coffee House Press
www.coffeehousepress.org
Marty Matze – Graywolf Press
www.graywolfpress.org
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books
www.unbridledbooks.com
Dan:
Hello there, thank you for agreeing to spend some time answering questions about yourself and publicity in general.
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Thank you for the invitation, Dan.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Good to be here.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
Dan, thanks so much for thinking of me for this interview!
Dan:
Let’s start by asking how you ended up being a publicist, and specifically, how did you become involved with the company you’re currently with?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
I’ve worked in a series of book-related jobs: at Blue Mesa Review at the University of New Mexico, at Page One, Inc., an independent book store in Albuquerque, and as an intern at Graywolf Press. Shortly after my internship, I was hired as a Marketing Assistant at Coffee House and have taken over more and more of the publicity duties since then.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
I started out working for the Utne Reader in Minneapolis as an Editorial Intern, and worked with their Marketing Director (at the time, Kat Knudson) on a few projects. We hit it off, I had a blast, and voila! I knew I wanted to be a part of the publishing industry. Kat recommended me to the publicist at Graywolf, J.Robbins. I worked as a Marketing Assistant at Graywolf for three years, and was recently promoted to publicist.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I've always had a keen interest in publishing and worked on magazines through high school and college. After college I worked at Random House. I was an editorial assistant/receptionist at Vintage. I sat by the elevator banks and greeted people, answered 20 phone lines, and read manuscripts and wrote back ad and looked for good new books. I loved the team, but I soon realized that I wasn't an editor and decided to move on. Next, I was an independent bookseller. But the store went out of business. Then, after grad school, I began doing information interviews, and among them was an interview with a publicist at a Boulder publishing company. Fred Ramey at MacMurray & Beck heard about that interview and gave me a call regarding his Marketing Director position. I've worked with Fred Ramey and Greg Michalson ever since, from MacMurray & Beck to BlueHen/Putnam and now at Unbridled! While I wasn't at my best helping to shape a writer's story, I found that I loved talking about why a writer's work mattered to me, so the job is a perfect fit!
Dan:
Are there a certain set of skills that you believe are needed to be a good publicist? What about a certain level of education?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
The best publicists are sharp observers of the world around them and are unafraid to take risks. Knowing something about the industry, loving books, and wanting to share that love with others are all necessary parts of the job. I don’t think it’s a job that requires a certain amount or type of education. Backgrounds in Communication and English would certainly help anyone interested in becoming a publicist.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Skills: Personality, passion for literature, passion for details, ability to write, ability to work with many personalities, initiative, follow-through, vision...
Education: Having a bachelor’s degree in English is a good background, but it is imperative to have an interest in contemporary literature.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I don't know that education matters as much as a skill set, a mind set, and work experience. Certainly people should have a college degree, and studies in the humanities are very valuable. But I don't think you need to be an English major to be a publicist, for instance. I wasn't. More than education, I believe a publicist should demonstrate writing skill, be detail-oriented, and have a good phone manner as well as the ability to persevere, enthusiasm for his/her books, an eye for pinpointing audiences, an interest in learning, and a passion for books and reading.
Dan:
If you replaced an individual, were there any specific changes that you made to the methods of getting publicity for your writers?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Publicity by nature is an ever-changing job. Names and venues change. Each season brings new books, new authors, and new opportunities to publicize those books and authors. We constantly make small changes and minute shifts to try and ‘perfect’ the job we’re doing.
The Marketing Director, Molly Mikolowski, and I have certainly shifted more focus to blogs and other online venues in the last couple of years as they’ve matured and become such an organized and easily accessible source for readers.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Graywolf has a reputation for being literary, which has a tendency to discourage a certain kind of reader. I want people to start seeing us as approachable and fun, as well as literary. My colleagues and I have been brainstorming about direct ways to reach smart readers. We decided to focus more energy on the internet generation and book groups. This includes reaching out to bloggers, developing focused email lists, and creating pod casts. We also decided to start advertising in book group magazines and consistently creating study guide questions.
Graywolf has a diverse list of titles and authors, and I want to do focused media campaigns that target diverse audiences. How can we be sure that we're reaching our intended readers? This is difficult to know. We are in the process of developing and researching contact lists for niche markets.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled books:
This question does not apply to me.
Dan:
How close to being an 8 hour a day/40 hours per week job is it?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
To echo many others in previous panels, this depends on the time of year and what’s going on in the office, with tours, with pending media coverage, etc. With events, conferences, worrying, scheming, and reading, it can be a very irregular schedule. There are times, though, when you can enjoy a 40-hour work week.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
I very rarely have a weekend that I don't think about or plan for things I need to do in the coming week. Almost everything I read, including magazines, newspapers, and books, are related to my job. Readings, book fairs, and media trips take up weekends and evenings as well as inter-industry related gatherings. Sometimes it's 40 hours, sometimes it's 60-80 hours/week.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I put in far more than 40 hours a week, routinely. Attending author events is extra. I also find my mind turning to work during time off. It's hard to read anything--magazine, blog, newspaper--or pay attention to any media without thinking, in the end, about work and one's books. It's hard for me to browse in bookstores without working as well. I imagine this is true for most publicists~ in some way, we're always working!!
Dan:
Some of your writers probably have established audiences – when you are trying to garner publicity for a new work by them, how much of your efforts go towards that established audience, and how much goes towards finding a new audience?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
I would say that most of the effort goes to reaching the established audience. One of the fun aspects of the job, though, is coming up with creative ways to expand that audience by reaching new readers.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
The challenge, of course, is to maintain relationships with current readers, as well as reaching out to new readers.
A nice thing about established audiences is that they help spread the word. Word-of-mouth is on of the most powerful tools in helping with book sales. We have to be creative and aggressive when reaching new readers. How we do so varies greatly with each author and book.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
At Unbridled, the authors we publish are often new, so we are building their audiences. But for those who return with books, and there are many, we always try to build a broader audience. We certainly value an author's longstanding fan base and market to them, but we always make pushes to reach new readers for each book. We want our authors' audiences to grow--and to continue to grow. I don't know what the time breakdown would be specifically, but definitely much more of our effort goes toward reaching new readers for our returning authors.
Dan:
We keep hearing how much more responsibility is being put on the writers themselves in terms of publicity. How do see that this has changed in recent years?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Part of the responsibility for publicity has always been with the authors. They can be the best representatives of their work and they tend to know a number of people in the industry who are interested in their work. However, with the expansion of online forums and book clubs, for instance, writers can really boost their own publicity more easily than in the past. Personal web sites, blogs, and other outlets allow writers to connect much more readily with their audiences, too. Authors certainly seem to be taking advantage of that and I think that’s a good thing.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
We currently exist in a celebrity culture, and fans want access to their icons. Authors have to be available for public performance, print interviews, radio programs, book group discussions, have a web site, and a public email. None of this was required or even recommended for authors in the past. Imagine James Joyce maintaining a web site...
Of course, Graywolf is actively involved in publicity for all of our authors, which doesn't happen at a lot of presses.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I see more and more writers becoming educated about both the industry and what publicity is and demands, and I see more and more authors taking an active role in their publicity campaigns. The marketplace requires it. With so many books being published, and so much competition with other media for our leisure time, authors realize that they need to be proactive in getting their books to readers. More authors are teaming up to help each other out and tour together; more authors have their own web sites and now, blogs.
At each press with which I've worked, we have asked for author involvement. The authors are part of the team. At Unbridled, we do expect authors to chip in with mailing labels for their mailing list, with ideas, with websites (if they can) and, in a couple of cases, some have even helped to schedule some of their bookstore readings (but they'll coordinate such with me. I ask that a writer check with me first before pursuing an event, or really anything publicity-wise). So we appreciate author involvement.
Dan:
What percentage of the writers you have to work with balk at this notion, or are at the very least reluctant to spend much time out there doing publicity?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
It depends on scheduling and financial restrictions. Most authors—I’d say 98%—that I’ve worked with are excited about getting the word out about their book and don’t have any problem doing what they can to make that happen.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Most of my authors are very interested in helping to promote the book, but don't know what to do to help. I recommend The Savvy Author's Guide to Book Publicity by Lissa Warren as well as M.J. Rose's Publicize Your Book. The relationship between author and a marketing department is a fine balance. I appreciate authors providing me with information about themselves, their connections to media and reviewers, and key points about their book. It's important that authors are thinking about audiences that will directly relate to their writing.
I have very few authors who aren't willing to help with publicity. Sometimes non-involvement from the author creates an enigmatic persona, and generates more media interest.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
Very few authors balk at helping with publicity, though some are more comfortable with it than others. Each author recognizes that he/she needs to be a part of their book's success. One works with each individual author to see where he/she can best help. All the authors appreciate the chance to be involved in some way and to have some control. There are so many stories out there about bad experiences between authors and publicists that I think it's important for writers to understand the publicity process and timeline, and to have a voice. It allows a level of trust to develop between writer and publicist.
Dan:
In the past, I’ve received both full press packets, and just books with the press release from most of you. How do you determine when to send which?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Chicken bones, the moon, tarot cards—seriously it’s sometimes a random process. Mostly we want the media to be as informed as possible without bombarding them with information they already have or don’t need. We tailor press kits to suit different media venues or, sometimes, specific individuals. If time is crunched, we just send whatever we’ve got.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
I send what the reviewer has indicated they want. If there is no indication, I usually just send a one page press release. If more info is wanted, reviewers and event coordinators will ask. If I'm trying to pitch a special interest story, I'll include a more developed press kit.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I tend to write personal letters more than press releases and always have. It was how I started at MacMurray & Beck. What I add that is supplemental--praise sheets, bios, etc.--depends on each book, the audience I'm trying to reach and the message I'm trying to convey. In general, I tend not to use press kits for print media but more for broadcast and events. And I use actual press kits less in general now than I used to, with the availability of online press kits.
Dan:
Looking at various forms of media – how do you go about marketing the book via newspapers?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
We pitch to book review editors, freelance reviewers, on staff reviewers, and, if it applies, section editors like features, news, etc. Of course we’ll take out ads when it seems appropriate, as well.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
There's no formula to this, but after we have sent galleys and review copies we make follow-up calls. We focus on local angles, national interests, and/or universal appeal. I also work with savvy freelancers, including John Freeman, who have a vested interest in shopping their reviews out to newspapers across the country. If we're lucky, newswires pick up a story, and it will reach up to 25 different cities.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
As we all know, we've lost a lot of review space. I still work on getting reviews but also try for off the book page coverage and op-eds. With newspapers, I am always interested in the possibility of getting coverage on the wires.
Dan:
How about via the internet?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Books or emails go out to bloggers, online magazines, and print publications with online segments. We also encourage our authors to develop their own web sites and we use our web site as a promotional tool. We’ve started to look into advertising opportunities, but with a limited marketing budget that’s not a real option yet.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
The internet is a relatively new medium for Graywolf. I've been leaning on our talented interns to help me navigate the literary blogs, bloggers, Amazon reviewers, list serves, etc. The problem with a 2.5 person publicity staff (.5 is my marketing assistant, Colleen Maley, who also maintains our warehouse), is that there is only so much output we can handle.
For example, a very lovely person from the internet radio station, VoiceAmerica, approached us with an attractive proposal to do an internet radio show for 6 months. Since the literary community hasn't been using this kind of internet communication, there is no way for a press of our size to gauge the benefit. Furthermore, the question is, where do we get the staff to put something like that together? Who will produce, who will host, where are the extra hours in the day? Ultimately, we have to ask ourselves if we need to change our entire way of thinking about the internet. We don't want to be the first person at a dance that nobody shows up to, but we don't want to be left behind.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I am increasingly pursuing Internet reviews, interviews, and stories. I try to target my pitches to the sites/people that would be most interested in the author and/or work, just as I do with all media. I work with bloggers and am thrilled about the creation of the LBC. In addition, at Unbridled we also hope to tap in to reading groups and other specialized markets through targeted online promotion and are actively promoting the Unbridled web site as a place for great literary finds.
Dan:
What about radio – is that a viable media for publicizing books?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Radio is great for publicizing books. NPR in general, Terry Gross, Diane Rehm, Michael Silverblatt, Leonard Lopate—all of these radio venues do amazing things for books. We try to alert as many of these folks as we can about upcoming work. This is an area where the internet is expanding the possibilities, too. Audiences can find segments they missed or want to listen to again pretty easily on the internet. Then you have internet radio like WPS1, which is really mining internet possibility to connect to a wide audience and to make extensive archives available.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Radio is awesome for publicizing books, and can have an incredible effect on book sales. We've watched Amazon numbers jump dramatically after spots on 'The Connection' and 'Fresh Air.'
How many other mediums reach so many people at one time and in such an intimate manner? Think about radio hits like WBEZ's 'This American Life,' which has changed the way people think about the radio. Ira Glass has created a cultural phenomenon by telling people's stories, and he has thousands of listeners. Glass' show seemed to be a powerful medium in David Sedaris' career - now people want to hear Sedaris speak, as well as buy his books. It's an extremely powerful tool that can be adapted to showcasing literature.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I think NPR is wonderful for the kinds of books I most often represent (fiction). I also think that when an author has a tie-in to the news, radio can be a great outlet for additional exposure and sales. For instance, novelist Masha Hamilton, as a former foreign correspondent in the Middle East, is able to speak to a number of timely issues, and there has been strong interest in her among a variety of radio talk shows, from NPR to women's shows, etc.
Dan:
Some of the best reviews I’ve read have been in literary journals – I would see those as good because you obviously have a reading audience seeing them, but not that many people would see them. How often do you look at those as a means of getting the word out about one of your books?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Literary journals are great for reviews and they can extend the life of a book because they’re not as concerned about timing their coverage to coincide with publication. Because they tend to have more space and more time than other outlets, reviews can be more in depth and include more information. It’s true that the audience is limited, but that audience is absolutely worth reaching. We do make contact with a number of literary journals, though these are often second or third tier targets because of the extended time between publication date and the date the review actually comes out.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Well, not that many people seeing them is one way to look at it. Graywolf heavily relies on the reviews that run in literary journals. Academics and literary fans are reading our books, and the reviews inform their decisions about what they are teaching in their classes and recommending to their friends. Our press is a home for 'literary' books - I feel confident that people reading literary journals are interested in literary books.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I work with literary journals with which the author has a reputation or with which Unbridled or its publishers have a reputation. On our web site, we have also posted links to literary journals in which our authors have published.
Dan:
For those that this can apply to – do you attack getting publicity for a non-fiction book any differently than for a work of fiction?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Yes and no. It depends on the book and the author. As you might expect, it is actually easier to pinpoint a target audience with nonfiction. Subject matter can easily dictate who will be interested in a particular nonfiction book, where with fiction it can involve more guess work.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Well, of course you pitch to reviewers who are interested in non-fiction rather than fiction. I think nonfiction opens many different venues that are off-limits in fiction. Depending on the type of book it is, you can delve into more "news oriented" topics, and pitch it to special interest journalists.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
With each book, one writes a unique plan, but certainly it's easier to pinpoint an audience for a nonfiction title. Also, more review space goes to nonfiction, and broadcast is more interested in nonfiction, so one has greater opportunities with the media. You apply the same skills as you would with pitching fiction titles.
At Unbridled, our nonfiction list is mostly memoir, so while our nonfiction titles may tie in to the news, we also anticipate that they'll have the long life that our fiction has with word-of-mouth. We can start with the greater media push because of the responsiveness of media toward nonfiction, then market for the long-term as well.
Dan:
How about any differences between getting notice for a novel versus a short story collection?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Again, this depends on the book and the author and a number of other factors.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
It is much harder to get publicity for debut short story collections vs. a debut novel. Even established novelists that publish a debut short story collection are difficult. If the short story writer is established and admired, it is much, much easier to get notice for the new collection.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I think the common thinking is that short story collections are harder to get support and coverage for than novels. I haven't gotten to work with a lot of story collections. While it was harder than working on a novel, we had good success with Edward Falco's SABBATH NIGHT IN THE CHURCH OF THE PIRANHA. It got good reviews, was a Book Sense Pick, had and has strong support at EWN, and is still generating interest. Falco has a great reputation, and it might have been harder for a collection that was a first book perhaps. We also published a second book by Falco in the same year--a novel--and used that to give the stories additional exposure.
Dan:
Assuming you got into this line of work because of a love of reading – do you still get to read much material that does not come from your press or clients?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Mostly. There are times of the year where I’m reading nothing but Coffee House books, but there are others when I have more time for leisure reading. I’m trying to slowly get through our backlist, too. There’s nineteen years worth of great books that were published before I took this job, so that should keep me busy for awhile.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
I definitely try to read books outside of the press. Reading contemporary literature is one of the best ways to have a sense of what people are reading and why it's successful. Also, I like talking about books, just as much as I like reading them. I like to keep up with what authors, reviewers, and editors are reading as well as the book buying community. What makes me want to run out and buy a book (that isn't from Graywolf)? I try to pay attention to those urges.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I don't get as much reading time as I'd like. Lately, I've been digging in to some mystery series I love and taking a look at some classics and contemporary fiction I've missed.
Dan:
Do you ever do any networking with other publicists – share media sources, or anything like that?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Occasionally. We’re very lucky here in the Twin Cities to have so many fine publishers. Graywolf Press and Milkweed Editions are just two of these and I feel a lot of camaraderie with those presses and their publicists. We have shared helpful advice, ideas, and things to keep our eyes on.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
I do network with our local publicists, but we keep the table talk to a minimum. We publish fairly different things, and we have different budgets. But we do trade information occasionally. We're pretty friendly.
I've also worked with other publicists on media resources when an author is publishing two books at once. It can be a valuable information trade. Once in a while, we'll ask for advice from our distributor, Farrar, Straus & Giroux.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I have one or two publicists I chat with ~ ask each other questions, toss ideas around, discuss the industry, pass along leads. I also chat, of course, with Alaine Borgias in Unbridled publicity.
Dan:
Knowing the publishers that you all work for, I’m assuming this is pretty rare, but how often do you have to do publicity for a book that you really don’t care for? Is it any harder for you to do so than for books you really love?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
I feel incredibly lucky to work for such a terrific press where even if I don’t love something we’re putting out there (which is rare) I am aware of its merit and quality. It’s easier to gush about something that makes you salivate, but I think that part of the job is to get these books into the hands of people who will love them unabashedly and that energizes me as I work on every book.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Dan, the million dollar question: if you don't love a book at first, you learn to love it during the publishing process. I absolutely have to find things I like about a book, or I wouldn't be doing my job.
A lot of times the books I really, really love, don't do well at all. That's harder for me than having an acquired-taste-book become successful.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
I don't feel like this question applies. Working so consistently with Fred Ramey and Greg Michalson, I've not had a problem with having to work on a book I didn't like. There was one book that concerned me because I figured out the mystery immediately, so the editor had the author rewrite a critical page. But that was it. In ten years. Certainly some books resonate for me more than others. But they all have something that makes them shine, something that intrigues. Something I want to share with others.
Dan:
What lessons learned do you think would be most important in passing along to anybody who was thinking of becoming a publicist?
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
Finding out everything you possibly can about books, authors, events, etc. is so important. The more you know, the more you are able to do for each project that comes your way.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Keep an open mind, keep an ear to the ground, think creatively, and be patient.
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
Love what you do. It's that simple. If the work doesn't get you up in the morning, if you aren't invested, then move on. Care about books and writing and literacy. Care about the books and writers you represent. You have to care because it's a tough industry, and that commitment to a voice and vision matter. Persevere. And celebrate every hit.
Dan:
Thanks again for sharing so much valuable information!
Lauren Snyder - Coffee House Press:
My pleasure, Dan.
Mary Matze - Graywolf Press:
Thanks for having me!
Caitlin Hamilton Summie – Unbridled Books:
Thanks for this neat opportunity, Dan! If I may, I would like to say we're about to release Lamar Herrin's HOUSE OF THE DEAF, a novel that moved me deeply. I hope people will give it a look.
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